07-15-2006, 03:15 AM
In reply to post 13
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->Despite its detractors' most prejudiced and patently false opinion, Vishwa Hindu Parishad has been doing excatly what you have suggested, which is convince and has been doing this for close to fifty years.
The vaccum in its membership, influence, support, educatation is glaring(even in the Hindi heartland where it was born). Perhaps I was being immoderate by attributing this lack of success to self-flagellation. Whatever reason (dhimmitude, limitless getpragmatism, callousness, I dont know), but unifying Hindus for whatever reason - even the threat of extinction - is simply a false dream to pursue.
Maybe I am just too crestfallen pal.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Utepian,
I know the kind of "convincing" carried out by the VHP. They along with the RSS do more harm than good in this instance. Their position is "Islam is a great religion, Mohammed is a great Prophet, but the Muslims are fools." So the question arises why don't we convince Muslims to follow their "great" religion?. These people don't have an answer for it. Guruji Gowalkar used to praise Islam as being as good as his own religion. Here is Guruji Gowalkar in his own words at Bangalore in November, 1965:
"So that bedrock of Ultimate Reality can join us all together. It does not belong to any one religion. On this account everyone can accept this as common basis. Religion is only a way of worship. This basic faith is not a mere way of worship. This is a philosophical understanding of the universe. The God of Islam, Christianity and Hinduism is thus the same and we are all His devotees."
"Let our Muslims here say that they belong to this land and that the past aggressors and their aggressions are not part of their heritage."
"I am an optimist and feel that Hinduism and Islam will learn to live with each other."
In his book Bunch of Thoughts, Guruji does identify the crimes of Muslims, but does not connect them to Islam:
"Our leaders, were therefore faced with the problem of weaning these people away form their hostile mood and bringing them to the patriotic ranks. There was a very rational and patriotic way of approach. That was to tell them frankly: "Dear friends, the days of old Moghul Badshahi have passed. Now both of us will have to live ultimately as brothers here, as co-sharers in this national life. After all, you also belong to the same race as ours, to the same blood of ours, but converted to Islam at the point of sword by those Moghul, Turk and other foreign races. Now, there is no point in your continuing to associate yourself mentally with those foreign aggressors and trying to follow in their footsteps. Forget all such separatist memories, merge yourself in the life of this soil. Hereafter try to respect and follow the examples of the great sons of this land who fought for the freedom and honour of our motherland and our culture."
The Sangh's position has not changed from that of Guruji Gowalkar. Many people of RSS and VHP say similar things or worse (Remember Dattopant Thengdi giving example of Mohammed as a generous person). Assuming you are in India, visit your local RSS shakha or talk to an acharya of the VHP, you will get more of the same, not to mention their fetishes of finding "nationalist muslims" (whatever that means), and trying to get "secular" certificates from the wrong sort of people.
Here are my favourite quotes from VHP/RSS during the Ayodhya movement: "Allah doesn't accept prayers at a disputed site" and "Islam doesn't allow taking someone else's palce of worship".
Do the above quotes show any comprehension of Islam?
I don't believe in their approach of sugarcoating the truth (if they are aware of it at all). That kind of "convincing" confuses our people or turns them off.
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->Despite its detractors' most prejudiced and patently false opinion, Vishwa Hindu Parishad has been doing excatly what you have suggested, which is convince and has been doing this for close to fifty years.
The vaccum in its membership, influence, support, educatation is glaring(even in the Hindi heartland where it was born). Perhaps I was being immoderate by attributing this lack of success to self-flagellation. Whatever reason (dhimmitude, limitless getpragmatism, callousness, I dont know), but unifying Hindus for whatever reason - even the threat of extinction - is simply a false dream to pursue.
Maybe I am just too crestfallen pal.<!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->
Utepian,
I know the kind of "convincing" carried out by the VHP. They along with the RSS do more harm than good in this instance. Their position is "Islam is a great religion, Mohammed is a great Prophet, but the Muslims are fools." So the question arises why don't we convince Muslims to follow their "great" religion?. These people don't have an answer for it. Guruji Gowalkar used to praise Islam as being as good as his own religion. Here is Guruji Gowalkar in his own words at Bangalore in November, 1965:
"So that bedrock of Ultimate Reality can join us all together. It does not belong to any one religion. On this account everyone can accept this as common basis. Religion is only a way of worship. This basic faith is not a mere way of worship. This is a philosophical understanding of the universe. The God of Islam, Christianity and Hinduism is thus the same and we are all His devotees."
"Let our Muslims here say that they belong to this land and that the past aggressors and their aggressions are not part of their heritage."
"I am an optimist and feel that Hinduism and Islam will learn to live with each other."
In his book Bunch of Thoughts, Guruji does identify the crimes of Muslims, but does not connect them to Islam:
"Our leaders, were therefore faced with the problem of weaning these people away form their hostile mood and bringing them to the patriotic ranks. There was a very rational and patriotic way of approach. That was to tell them frankly: "Dear friends, the days of old Moghul Badshahi have passed. Now both of us will have to live ultimately as brothers here, as co-sharers in this national life. After all, you also belong to the same race as ours, to the same blood of ours, but converted to Islam at the point of sword by those Moghul, Turk and other foreign races. Now, there is no point in your continuing to associate yourself mentally with those foreign aggressors and trying to follow in their footsteps. Forget all such separatist memories, merge yourself in the life of this soil. Hereafter try to respect and follow the examples of the great sons of this land who fought for the freedom and honour of our motherland and our culture."
The Sangh's position has not changed from that of Guruji Gowalkar. Many people of RSS and VHP say similar things or worse (Remember Dattopant Thengdi giving example of Mohammed as a generous person). Assuming you are in India, visit your local RSS shakha or talk to an acharya of the VHP, you will get more of the same, not to mention their fetishes of finding "nationalist muslims" (whatever that means), and trying to get "secular" certificates from the wrong sort of people.
Here are my favourite quotes from VHP/RSS during the Ayodhya movement: "Allah doesn't accept prayers at a disputed site" and "Islam doesn't allow taking someone else's palce of worship".
Do the above quotes show any comprehension of Islam?
I don't believe in their approach of sugarcoating the truth (if they are aware of it at all). That kind of "convincing" confuses our people or turns them off.