01-11-2006, 10:43 PM
Note: Post #10 of this thread contained excerpts of Elst's articles who was <i>referring to the works of S. Talageri</i> on the Puranas and the Rig Veda.
About the Bhrgus, Elst again at http://koenraadelst.bharatvani.org/books/ait/ch46.htm:<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin--><b>Talageri tentatively identifies the other tribes </b>as well: the Druhyu as the Druids or Celts (untenable)48; <b>the Bhrgus as the Phrygians (etymologically reasonable); </b>the AlInas as the Hellenes or Greeks (shaky); the Shimyus with the Sirmios/Srems or ancient Albanians (possible), etc. It is hard to prove or disprove this; all we can say is that along with the Iranian tribes, there may have been several non-Iranian tribes who emigrated from northwestern India after the Battle of the Ten Kings. <!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->So the identification of the Bhrgus as Phrygians by Talageri is based on his reasoning about the Rg Veda and on etymological grounds. But there seems to be <b>further evidence for this</b>, provided at a site of a Greek person. (Looking around his site, I didn't agree with most of his conclusions on genetics research papers because he reads the AIT into everything, even where it is in direct disagreement with the genetics paper itself). But he pasted something about the Phrygians that is not based on his opinion at http://dienekes.blogspot.com/ under the section "Some random (?) facts"
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->The Phrygians had an equipment very like that of the Paphlagonians with some slight difference. Now <b>the Phrygians, as the Macedonians say, used to be called Brigians</b> during the time that they were natives of Europe and dwelt with the Macedonians; but after they had changed into Asia, with their country they changed also their name and were called Phrygians. The Armenians were armed just like the Phrygians, being settlers from the Phrygians. Of these two together the commander was Artochmes, who was married to a daughter of Dareios." <b>Herodotus, vii, 73</b><!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->Although Herodotus relates that the Phrygians were natives to Europe when they were still called Brigians, Herodotus was relatively recent. It is still entirely possible and likely that the Bhrgus moved out of Indian-Iranian lands into Southern Europe while still being called Brigians, then moved back into Asia* and changed their name to Phrygians as their memories of older times grew remote.
*The distance between near-Greece in Europe and near-Armenia in Asia is not too great, so they could have made the move from Asia to Europe and back, de-emphasising the impression of having traversed "two continents".
About the Bhrgus, Elst again at http://koenraadelst.bharatvani.org/books/ait/ch46.htm:<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin--><b>Talageri tentatively identifies the other tribes </b>as well: the Druhyu as the Druids or Celts (untenable)48; <b>the Bhrgus as the Phrygians (etymologically reasonable); </b>the AlInas as the Hellenes or Greeks (shaky); the Shimyus with the Sirmios/Srems or ancient Albanians (possible), etc. It is hard to prove or disprove this; all we can say is that along with the Iranian tribes, there may have been several non-Iranian tribes who emigrated from northwestern India after the Battle of the Ten Kings. <!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->So the identification of the Bhrgus as Phrygians by Talageri is based on his reasoning about the Rg Veda and on etymological grounds. But there seems to be <b>further evidence for this</b>, provided at a site of a Greek person. (Looking around his site, I didn't agree with most of his conclusions on genetics research papers because he reads the AIT into everything, even where it is in direct disagreement with the genetics paper itself). But he pasted something about the Phrygians that is not based on his opinion at http://dienekes.blogspot.com/ under the section "Some random (?) facts"
<!--QuoteBegin-->QUOTE<!--QuoteEBegin-->The Phrygians had an equipment very like that of the Paphlagonians with some slight difference. Now <b>the Phrygians, as the Macedonians say, used to be called Brigians</b> during the time that they were natives of Europe and dwelt with the Macedonians; but after they had changed into Asia, with their country they changed also their name and were called Phrygians. The Armenians were armed just like the Phrygians, being settlers from the Phrygians. Of these two together the commander was Artochmes, who was married to a daughter of Dareios." <b>Herodotus, vii, 73</b><!--QuoteEnd--><!--QuoteEEnd-->Although Herodotus relates that the Phrygians were natives to Europe when they were still called Brigians, Herodotus was relatively recent. It is still entirely possible and likely that the Bhrgus moved out of Indian-Iranian lands into Southern Europe while still being called Brigians, then moved back into Asia* and changed their name to Phrygians as their memories of older times grew remote.
*The distance between near-Greece in Europe and near-Armenia in Asia is not too great, so they could have made the move from Asia to Europe and back, de-emphasising the impression of having traversed "two continents".